11-04-2005, 03:52 AM
im running about 26 psi and im at 26* timing currently, on the dyno i was at 27* at 28-30 psi and i run 110 or 118 all the time, depending on whats available.
11-04-2005, 08:18 PM
From talking to other people around the 400hp mark on the timing issue we all seemed to reach the same conclusion.
When I had dynoed the car awhile back we were playing with the timing and reached what I could only call a platue (sp) as far as timing goes.
We had the car running at 15-16psi and started at 20degree's of timing. When we increased the timing from 20 to 22 the car picked up about 15 rwhp. When I went from 22 to 24 it picked up another 12rwhp. Going from 24 to 26 the car gained 6rwhp and for curiosity sake I tried 27 and gained another 4rwhp.
Once the car crossed the 24degree's total timing it didn't really pick up enough power to worry about. We ended up taking the timing back out of it because the 10rwhp wasn't worth the extra 3 degrees of timing on a street car. This was on pump fuel as well. I'm not sure how much hp it might or might not at a higher boost/hp level but will let you guys know when I find out.
When I had dynoed the car awhile back we were playing with the timing and reached what I could only call a platue (sp) as far as timing goes.
We had the car running at 15-16psi and started at 20degree's of timing. When we increased the timing from 20 to 22 the car picked up about 15 rwhp. When I went from 22 to 24 it picked up another 12rwhp. Going from 24 to 26 the car gained 6rwhp and for curiosity sake I tried 27 and gained another 4rwhp.
Once the car crossed the 24degree's total timing it didn't really pick up enough power to worry about. We ended up taking the timing back out of it because the 10rwhp wasn't worth the extra 3 degrees of timing on a street car. This was on pump fuel as well. I'm not sure how much hp it might or might not at a higher boost/hp level but will let you guys know when I find out.
11-04-2005, 10:16 PM
Daggysvo - excellent! that's what I was trying to get across. When you reach a power/reliability level you're comfortable with it really doesn't matter if someone else is running 20 more degrees than you. All that matters is your combo.
Actually it sounds to me like if you need that much advance your ignition might be weak. It's pretty common on blown alcohol setups to require less advance as ignition output goes up.
Half Fast Racing
Quote:Originally posted by Joe Morgan:I disagree. It's entirely possible I might find some small gains with more timing but just like daggy's the potential loss of reliability isn't worth it to me right now.
Dayum...mine's near 13:1 compression and it still picked up a couple MPH going from 25 to 27...LOL...methinks you may have some other issues you may have to deal with.
Actually it sounds to me like if you need that much advance your ignition might be weak. It's pretty common on blown alcohol setups to require less advance as ignition output goes up.
Half Fast Racing
-------------------------------
Just a nobody with a slow car.
Just a nobody with a slow car.
11-05-2005, 04:32 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Joe Morgan:Hey! Thats the sig at the bottom of my emails
Like usual, you can return the unused portion of my advice for a full refund. :dunno:
LOL I'n my experience, talking to others about how much timing you run is a moot point unless you all have the same combo. Different cylinder pressures and rod lengths etc. are going to play a big role in what one can run "safely and reliably".
<----1993 Notch project in progress...
11-05-2005, 05:49 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Joe Morgan:This is exactly why I told daggysvo to ignore what numbers other people are running and just worry about what works on your own. "If you're not running the same timing as me then you're wrong" is not a very educated statement.
It's mostly the chamber that dictates timing requirements. If you can only run 15-16 degrees of timing in a wedge head -- you have some other issues to deal with. He and I both run similar combos on alcohol. Mine seems to run pretty well at a fairly "normal" lead. It's a little less lead than the same motor without a turbo, but not much less.
It is what it is and it takes a certain amount of time for the fuel to completely ignite. Retarded timing might be able to keep a messed-up combo alive, but it's really not the right way to go about it if you want to go fast *and* keep it alive.
As far as a "messed up combo" - Joe told me numerous times that to make serious power requires- a copper gasket - o-ring and receiver grooves done exactly right - then it will push water out every pass so you have to pull the head every 5 runs and "check things out" - lol - he must think that makes himself sound like Austin Coil.
I'm currently making well over 800 h.p. (JDB claims 840) on a Felpro 1035, no o-rings, only 10.4 compression at 35psi boost. That's over 5.5 hp/cu.in. with absolutely no water being pushed into the overflow at all. None. And this is 30 some passes on the same gasket without ever pulling the head. Sounds like one of us is lifting his head.
Could I make more power with more timing? Probably. But it makes more sense to me to leave the timing alone and raise the boost level. 16 deg seems to work for me for now. Am I saying everyone should run 16*? Of course not. It works for me, that's all I care about, that's the point I was trying to get across.
I learned one of the top running import 4 cylinder cars (185+ mph) only runs 8 degrees total. Does this make them wrong? No, it's just a number.
-------------------------------
Just a nobody with a slow car.
Just a nobody with a slow car.
11-05-2005, 07:28 PM
[ 04-07-2006, 04:57 PM: Message edited by: Joe Morgan ]
Took my ball and went home... :bawl:
Took my ball and went home... :bawl:
« Next Oldest | Next Newest »
Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)