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M5OD to Automatic
#11

(05-18-2022, 11:34 PM)norman.quilhot Wrote:  Just Add Boost, how is your c4 on the highway?

Large or small bowl pattern on the C4?

What is all need to do this swap? Can anyone supply a parts list? Can I use any C4? Looking at a TCI street fighter at the moment or does it have to be one from a pinto?
Mine has a 4.10 rear gear with a 28" tall tire and runs about 3000rpm at 60mph.
Definitely would go with a taller rear gear for extended highway driving.
All you need is the 2.3 bell and flexplate to install the C4. My C4 came from a V8 car.
88 TC: 2.9L tall deck, SVO head, boport header, sheet metal intake, BWS369SXE turbo, AWIC. C4 trans. E85
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#12

(05-19-2022, 05:30 PM)Just Add Boost Wrote:  All you need is the 2.3 bell and flexplate to install the C4.  
.AND.......<stickpoke> Wink :

  1. Converter (obviously).
  2. Shifter.
  3. Fill tube/dipstick.
  4. Proper length/splined driveshaft.
  5. Proper cross-member & mount.
  6. Cooler (integral w/radiator or aux air-cooler) and interconnecting lines/tubes.
  7. Misc nuts, bolts & vac hose.
Regarding converter choices.......Chris has more practical experience than I ~ BUT......having had a 5500-rpm/8-in converter (PowerGlide = BBC Super Gas Vega, never street-driven) ~ I suggest opting for a small-diameter version if you want a higher-than-stock stall speed. The larger converters (10", 11", etc.) can only be made to stall higher by machining away the fins (creating more space between the pump and turbine impellers). This generates more heat AND slows lockup ~ NOT good on the street.

OTOH, the more-expensive smaller converters (9", 8", 7") get their higher stall from size/diameter reduction (while maintaining close proximity of the drive & driven fins/impellers). This results in a lower/moderate lockup rpm AND less heating of the fluid ~ IOW, better for the street. My 2¢......  <shrug>
Placerville, California
(former)  '78 2.3T Courier w/blow-thru Autolite 2bbl carb ~ (current)  '87 2.3T Ranger w/PiMP’d EFI
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#13

Yep, converter selection is more critical with the turbo4 than a V8. Has to be loose enough for the off boost, low torque 4 banger to get up "on the converter" and yet tight enough to not "blow thru" the converter once you have boost.
Highway use complicates things without a lockup as steady operation well below rated stall speed builds heat also.
On the setup in question I would spec a 8"-9" converter with a 4500-5000 advertised stall and run a huge trans cooler, maybe even two of them to keep temps in check.
88 TC: 2.9L tall deck, SVO head, boport header, sheet metal intake, BWS369SXE turbo, AWIC. C4 trans. E85
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#14

Should I just keep my M5OD? Sounds like this is going to be a headache. I am looking for a cruiser and some weekend fun with this build. Nothing crazy at the moment. I was just thinking it would be best to go C4 because if in the future it would hold more Torque if I decided to add more boost down the road.
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#15

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Switching transmission styles is never easy or cheap, Norm. Since it's just the pedal effort you're trying to circumvent by swapping to an auto, perhaps you could do some research on various forums for a HD clutch with light pedal effort. It's been decades since I shopped for one ~ BUT......back in "the day", Centerforce clutches had "weighted" clutch fingers that used centrifugal force to add clamping pressure, while maintaining a light/stock pedal effort. I don't know what's available in that regard nowadays. 

Also, many of the older cars used a hefty "over-center" helper spring on the pedal linkage under the dash to assist in disengaging the clutch (tantamount to a "power clutch", lol). It helped a LOT ~ BUT......unfortunately, I haven't seen that strategy in decades!  <shrug>
Placerville, California
(former)  '78 2.3T Courier w/blow-thru Autolite 2bbl carb ~ (current)  '87 2.3T Ranger w/PiMP’d EFI
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#16

My only concern is the M5OD will not hold up to the power. I know the T5 is the best bet but don’t like the shifter being so far back. I know you can do a S10 tail but then that create other issues with making it work like the speed gear. I don’t want to be replacing a trans two times a year. I am settling already with losing ac and lower hp goal. I first wanted a goal of around 400hp to 500hp but after talking to people it’s and reading up I settled for around 350hp for more reliability. I like the sound of the C4 but don’t like the fact I will not have a OD for highway. But C4 would let me have room to grow if I did want more boost later. Thank you everyone for the info and time you have given me on this.
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#17

I have a messed up left foot also so a stick trans is a no go for me as well.
If you were feeling rich you could get a gear vendors OD that bolts in place of the tail housing on the C4.
Also check out the 200R4 swap that was done here a few years back. Worked out pretty good and the 200R4 can be built to hold some good power, way more than the AL4D.
88 TC: 2.9L tall deck, SVO head, boport header, sheet metal intake, BWS369SXE turbo, AWIC. C4 trans. E85
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#18

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I have a T5 with an S10 tail-housing conversion in my 2.3T Ranger, Norm, and the shifter (a moderately-long-lever short-throw Hurst) is in EXACTLY the correct spot (my hand just falls right onto the knob). As for the speedo problem, there are several solutions ( LINK ), including the installation of an actual S10 mainshaft. My T5 was already installed when I bought the truck, so I don't know how the PO did it. The issue is that the hole for the speedo "plug" (trans end of the cable) is farther forward.

The mainshaft has a raised (larger-diameter) section, as shown in the link above, where the speedo "drive gear" fits ~ so the shaft either needs to be one from an S10, OR......the Ford shaft needs to be shimmed larger with some brass or steel shim stock. I SUSPECT that the PO did the latter since I've read of several other folks who've done it that way successfully ~ BUT.......DUNNO. The HARD part is gathering all the parts & pieces.

As for the torque capacities of the two different trannies (T5 vs M50D).......DUNNO! Regarding power levels, having 400-500hp "on tap" from a 2.3 in a daily driver is "edgy"/unreliable AND very expensive ~ not to mention lacking the fun of being able to squirt from signal to signal. That's more than 3hp/cid ~ which is WAY more power density than the 1st-gen NHRA Pro Stockers (Jenkins, Leal, Glidden, etc.). 

Those kinda goals would be better fulfilled with a V-ate conversion, IMO. BUT......I think you'll be PLENTY  happy with a 300-ish hp 2.3 or 2.5 in a 3K-lb Ranger!.. I.e., according to my "always accurate" <rolleyes> power-speed calculator, that kinda power-to-weight ratio has the potential of 12-flat 1/4 mile ETs, with good traction.....which is hauling ass ~ especially on the street.

Auto vs manual? Obviously, your ankle injury plays a large role in that decision, BUT.......I would opt for the automatic. TF member "Howard" has knee replacements and he spent a lot of time researching, purchasing parts, and installing a GM 2004R in place of his former T5, using an OMC 2.3-to-Chevy bellhousing adapter. The entire project WAS linked in THIS thread, but - unfortunately - the link is now dead (???)! The 2004Rs are smallish (Powerglide/TH350-size) 4-speed automatics with lockup that were used in the turbo Buicks (GNs, GNXs, etc.) and, when built properly, can withstand over 1000hp.

By comparison, however, a C4 conversion ( LINK ) is infinitely easier ~ since it uses all "formerly"-stock parts (bell, flexplate, trans, converter, starter, etc.). As for the lack of overdrive ~ just use a tall rear gear (3.25 - 3.70-ish) for better gas mileage and let a high-stall converter help to offset the poorer "take-off" ratio.  <shrug>
Placerville, California
(former)  '78 2.3T Courier w/blow-thru Autolite 2bbl carb ~ (current)  '87 2.3T Ranger w/PiMP’d EFI
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#19

Thanks guys for all the info and time spent helping me. I really do appreciate it. I am going to look into the options that you guys have given me. The manual to auto swap was not something I really wanted to do all my vehicles are stick even my crown vic. But I am getting older and have worked my body very hard in my field of work 25 years climbing ladders with bundles of cables that were more than me and pulling thousands of miles of fiber optics has tore my knees and ankles up. So I guess it’s time to face reality I am getting older. Again thank you guys for all the info and time.

Ray, the link for the 200R4 is not working. It takes me to a thread and I see the link for the build but that link is no good. I would really love to read Howard’s thread on this and used the sites Search option and did not come up with anything on the thread except people talking about it.
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#20

(05-21-2022, 10:49 AM)norman.quilhot Wrote:  I am getting older and have worked my body very hard......tore my knees and ankles up.  

Ray, the link for the 200R4 is not working.  
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I don't know how old you are, Norm ~ BUT......I'm 77 and my back is destroyed.  "Getting old isn't for sissies", lol.

If you re-read what I posted about the 200R4.......you'll note that I said the link was dead. Howard spent a lot of time writing up all the details of that swap and I THOUGHT it was in the "FAQ Submission" section. I'm gonna email our fearless leader, Paul LeDuc, and ask if he can find & repost it. ADDENDUM: Found it......it was apparently moved to the "Member's Projects" section = LINK <shrug>
Placerville, California
(former)  '78 2.3T Courier w/blow-thru Autolite 2bbl carb ~ (current)  '87 2.3T Ranger w/PiMP’d EFI
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